JJ facing a weird line

AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
villain is a nice old recreational player. Has been really loose preflop and post flop making a couple of big hero calls with hands like A2o on a T84ccAx triple barrel run out where he won a nice $800 pot vs a missed fd. Overall his aggression and bluff frequency are very low which led to me folding this hand and playing passive preflop. In two hours of play he has never raised once.

Game is $1/$2/$3/straddle $6
EP calls $6
MP calls $6
SB ($800) main villain raises to $26
BB Hero ($425) :Jc :Jh calls $23 more
Straddler ($88) calls $20 more

flop ($79) :9s :2c :3s
SB checks
Hero bets $50
Straddler all in $62
SB calls $62
Hero calls $50 + $12

Turn ($265) :9s :2c :3s :5c
SB bets $100
Hero calls $100

River ($265 main + $200 (side)) :9s :2c :3s :5c :9h
SB all in
Hero ($237) folds.

In game I was thinking maybe he slow played some type of over pair, but his all in on the river doesn't make sense to be 9x cause he checked the flop. His Donk lead can still rep an over pair and also hands like AsQs+, but thats only like 2 combos. Maybe As5s? I was thinking he has to think I have 9x here so what is he shoving? bluff doesn't make sense at all. Maybe 55, but thats not consistent with his sb raise preflop. His range overall and line made absolutely no sense.

I based my fold off people dont really bluff into empty side pots on the turn and his passiveness the last two hours where the only hand he has bet were full houses where he had A8 on AA582 run out and some other full house where he had a small set. He played those hands passive as well until Turn or river as it was a pretty aggro game. Overall, I'm not happy with my fold and I feel I should be calling here given his line and range, but I really couldn't pull the trigger.
my player profile was correct for postflop play, but his raising range preflop that I gave him was way off and this would of been a 3 bet preflop had I known the hand he was raising with. Just what size to choose? Leaning towards $90.


  • SneakySneaky Red Chipper Posts: 84 ✭✭
    His line was very weird, but what value he can have there that beats us? QQ+ (18combos) A4s (4combos) = 24 combos
    9 like you said is unlikely, and he has loads of Double suited Broadway’s type hand that didn’t get there OTR.
    I’m probably calling
  • moishetreatsmoishetreats Red Chipper Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭✭
    I didn't see the spoiler.

    A couple of clarifying questions:

    1) What is V's image of you? And is he the type of player who would make a shove based on his image of you and his perception of your image of him?

    2) Why did you discount overpairs in your thought-process on the river, specifically QQ+?

    That being said, I think that I would reverse the last line of your post: "Overall, I'm not happy with my CALL and I feel I should be FOLDING here given his line and range, but I really couldn't pull the trigger."

    All that being said, I'm wondering (since you're posting) if V somehow had a 9 in his hand, which seems entirely out-of-character for him, and that's what surprised you. But, given the info that you presented, it would be hard to credit V with a 9.
  • Danny MDanny M Red Chipper Posts: 353 ✭✭✭
    I think combowise + w/ your read It's a fold. Once the 9 pairs he has to show you a 9, FH, or straight... + there's the player AI
    99 33 22 7 combos
    A4 46s 8 combos
    A9 K9 Q9 J9 T9 98 97s 14 combos
    29 combos of nuttish hands.. 15 if you discount a 9
    +QQ-AA but based on the fact he didn't raise the flop we can discount these imo

    What do you beat?
    Value wise just TT 3 combos.... I can't think of anything else... 88 77...
    I'm guessing villain hit a GS OTT or did he flop it?
  • jfarrow13jfarrow13 Red Chipper Posts: 1,194 ✭✭✭✭
    Hasn't raised much. C/c..Donk lead? I mean I think I gotta let it go on the river. Seems like an AA that maybe felt way ahead on the flop? AKss, AQss, AJss...all likely raising hands from SB. The decision to C/C the flop and lead the turn. Maybe he feels the only way to win when he gets to the turn is to come alive and start betting. Then again, he has so many more combos of overpairs than just the 3-4 of broadway spades. WHO AM I KIDDING I CANT FOLD OVERPAIRS TO SAVE MY LIFE I CALL SHOW ME THE BAD NEWS MAN.
  • moishetreatsmoishetreats Red Chipper Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭✭
    I'm re-thinking this. I think that you might be right to let it go.
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
    villain ended up having 22 for a full house. His preflop sizing really threw me off cause i rarely see people raise from SB in this spot especially after being passive for two hours.

    Can anyone find a fold on the turn? Getting 3.65 to 1 hard to fold an over pair on a wet board, but same logic applies to the turn.

    Recently on clp guy had 88 on 86x flop and raised flop and guy told him i put you on 88 but called with JJ anyways and spiked a J on the turn for a higher set. Bart explained how his logic was BS.

    My logic for calling the turn bet is that the bet sizing was a little small and if he had an over pair I want to see him tell the full story. If he has overs + fd i want to see if he gives up or continues with his story. Im not calling to spike a J on the river, :JS: would of been an interesting card.

    Overall how im viewing live poker
    Player profile and frequency > player pool bluff frequencies > ranges assigned

    I use to put so much thought into ranges, and still do, but low stake players can be so trappy the ranges are like 3rd on the list to consider when facing aggression in a marginal spot.

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