52s on the Button

Jaymes BJaymes B Red Chipper Posts: 64 ✭✭
1/2 Cash game. Max buy of 50bb. ($100)

Hero has $145 and has everyone covered.

Hero 52s on the button.

UTG - Raise to 6
UTG+1 - Call
MP +1 - Call
CO - Call
BUT - Call
SB - 3 bet to $16

Everyone calls.

Flop is 10 5 2 rainbow.

SB bets All-in for $81
UTG - Fold
UTG+1 - Fold
MP+4 - Fold
CO - Call
Hero - Call.

CO only has $3 behind after the call.

Was it correct for the hero to call in this instance?

Comments

  • NinjahNinjah Red Chipper Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭✭
    You had two separate times that you should have folded preflop and you didn't. This hand would be much better suited for deep stack play. Much, much deeper stacks.
  • Jaymes BJaymes B Red Chipper Posts: 64 ✭✭
    Under no circumstance should the hero called with that much money in the pot preflop?
  • BourbonizeBourbonize Red Chipper Posts: 43 ✭✭
    edited March 2018
    I'm folding this preflop and to the 3bet preflop.
  • NinjahNinjah Red Chipper Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭✭
    Jaymes B wrote: »
    Under no circumstance should the hero called with that much money in the pot preflop?

    The biggest issue is the stack sizes remaining. You have to take into account more than just the amount currently in the pot. You need to consider factors such as how often you hit the flop hard enough to feel good about your chances of winning (very low with this hand), the SPR, and implied odds. What happens when you only catch a pair? What happens if you have a flush draw and someone goes all in (they may have a stronger flush draw)?
  • Yanming ZYanming Z Red Chipper Posts: 294 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2018
    Jaymes B wrote: »
    Under no circumstance should the hero called with that much money in the pot preflop?

    The chance of flopping 2P or better with a hand like 52s is about 5%. Let's assume you always win when you flop those hands, i.e. no one has higher flush than you or your 2P doesn't get counterfeited, with a $16 preflop investment, you need to win around $300 just to break even.

    In realistic situations, you need to double the break even number. Because:
    1. You won't always win when you flop strong.
    2. You won't always get paid off when you flop strong.
    3. A lot of time you'll flop a draw which will force you to invest more money post flop.

    So to answer your question, you should call when the current odds + implied odds is $600 or better, or 35x your initial investment for quick calculations at the tables.

  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yanming Z wrote: »
    Jaymes B wrote: »
    Under no circumstance should the hero called with that much money in the pot preflop?

    The chance of flopping 2P or better with a hand like 52s is about 5%. Let's assume you always win when you flop those hands, i.e. no one has higher flush than you or your 2P doesn't get counterfeited, with a $16 preflop investment, you need to win around $300 just to break even.

    In realistic situations, you need to double the break even number. Because:
    1. You won't always win when you flop strong.
    2. You won't always get paid off when you flop strong.
    3. A lot of time you'll flop a draw which will force you to invest more money post flop.

    So to answer your question, you should call when the current odds + implied odds is $600 or better, or 35x your initial investment for quick calculations at the tables.

    This ^^

    in my opinion these are some simple rules to follow
    set mining try and get at least 15 : 1
    If you have to call $10 preflop, they need $150+ in their stack. Ignoring the details if they have a strong range or you can bluff them post flop etc.
    SCs 20:1 minimum. at $1/$2 if you are calling $10 you want them to have at least 100bb ($200), but prefer even higher.

    This is not to say you should fold every time, but if you have to make a hand in order to win then use 20:1 or more. If you are comfortable bluffing your draws and taking people off their hand who play face up, then if they have say 80bb+ stack I would still call preflop with hands like 76s-KQs. Where as if they have say $100 and they raise to $15 preflop with $85 behind and you have 76s, its pretty easy just to fold.
  • SullySully Red Chipper Posts: 780 ✭✭✭
    You should probably never see 52s in the title of a post where the first line says max buyin 50BB
  • Jaymes BJaymes B Red Chipper Posts: 64 ✭✭
    Thanks for the insight everyone.

    FYI:

    SB had Kings.
    CO had a set of 2s
    BUT flopped 2 pair

    Turn and river did nothing to improve anyone's hands.

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