Caller blindly leading when middle card pairs on turn...why?

BadgerBadger Red Chipper Posts: 27 ✭✭
I was watching a WTP and a Euro pro lead the turn after the board paired middle cards and Tony Dunst who was commenting, casually mentions that a lot of high level players are blindly betting their entire range in this particular scenario. In this particular case I think the board was 10, 8, 2 and the 8 paired on the turn but I cant remember the exact texture. He was stressing that they were leading whenever the middle card paired.

I am wondering why this would be a good idea?

Best thing I can come up with is that this flop favors the caller and not the preflop raiser. I am guessing the paired middle card gives them many more effective nut hands in this case but if they are betting blindly then this an extremely polarizing line as well.

Anybody got any ideas or thoughts on this?

Comments

  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper Posts: 4,363 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What do you mean "blindly?"
  • EatRunPokerEatRunPoker NY, NYRed Chipper Posts: 91 ✭✭
    I'm assuming this is generally applying to player calling from BB and check calling flop. In this situation the BB has many more combos of middle pair than the preflop raiser. Also if he has just top pair on a 10 8 2 - 8 board, the 8 is also a good card for him and he can be betting it often. The preflop raiser can only continue with his over pair and few 10x combos and if the bb player is sick enough to bluff shove river he can't even call with over pairs, because he just has way too many 8's in his range. The preflop aggressor has to consider this when calling the turn lead and has to realize he is no longer the aggressor and is mostly bluff-catching with his entire value range.

    I find these are especially good spots to lead turn when the lead creates somewhere around a 1:1 SPR if called. This really puts them in a tough spot as it looks like you're setting them up for a river shove.
  • kenaceskenaces Red Chipper Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭✭
    Badger wrote: »
    Best thing I can come up with is that this flop favors the caller and not the preflop raiser. I am guessing the paired middle card gives them many more effective nut hands in this case but if they are betting blindly then this an extremely polarizing line as well.

    Anybody got any ideas or thoughts on this?

    Sort of.

    After the flop goes check call and the turn heavily favors the OOP player's range - some "GTO" strategies will include a very high-frequency turn lead from OOP with a small size(~1/5 pot).

    In these spots, the OOP player now has range advantage so he can lead with a merged range(not polarized) hence the small sizing.

  • BadgerBadger Red Chipper Posts: 27 ✭✭
    Thanks for the info guys appreciate it.

    @persuadeo Blindly was a poor word choice, the announcer was stating that some players are leading the turn in this situation with their entire range. I would deem this "blindly" betting since your cards don't matter your doing something by wrote everytime in this particular situation. That's what intrigued me about it in particular, there are very few scenarios that I can think of you should always do the same thing. Implying this is one of them would argue its an extremely favorable exploit and one I might like to add to my arsenal if it is based on sound theory and strategy.
  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper Posts: 4,363 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well, you do it all the time without realizing it. When you cbet, especially on favorable boards, you very likely are barrelling far more of your range than you otherwise might. Conversely, when you check to the raiser on boards that favor him, you lay a price of zero on the board with your entire range.

    The difference lies only in who is laying the price one street earlier and who is accepting it, ameliorated by price or not, as these both perceivably and in often in reality respect the composition of each range.

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