Pre-flop pot odds in multi-way pots

BigFarmBigFarm MontrealRed Chipper Posts: 45 ✭✭
edited February 5 in General Concepts
This is just something that's been nagging at me for a while. Hypothetical scenario is a low-stakes live cash game ($1/$2). There is a raise to $12 from EP and 4 calls. Hero is in the BB with JTo.

I've seen a lot of posts with people defending a wide calling range because of pot odds. In fact, we are calling $10 into a pot of $62. So, yes of course the pot odds are great but the part that bugs me is that our equity is also much worse because it's multi-way. We are also out of position against all 5 players. These things need to be considered together.

So I'm curious, can somebody give a better reason to call with JTo besides "pot odds"? And do we also call with other offsuit broadways? Small pairs? Suited connectors?

I know there are a lot of other factors at play, but I want to bust the myth that justifying a call in a multi-way pot simply because of "pot odds" is a good strategy.


  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper, Table Captain Posts: 4,052 ✭✭✭✭✭
    No one credible is going to tell you to call based on pot odds alone. Situations are different, as well.

    NL is about stacks, most of all, so your j10o overcall will look good in an extremely short scenario, as it will always realize its equity, but fail once the spr denies its playability. Then it may succeed again in special deep scenarios. In other words, the decision is not just about a preflop overlay.
  • TravisTravis Red Chipper Posts: 455 ✭✭✭
    As Persuadeo said there are a lot of factors. In your example it is a layup call in most situations because your hand will have roughly 17% equity and 6 days you need 16.6%. So it is a profitable call but not by a ton. Whereas a hand like J8o will fall below the equity line.
    In thinking about those two hands which is more playable postflop? Or what happens when you go 5 way or 4 way instead of 6?
    Now how's your post flop edge? Cam you fold 2pr at the right times? Will you know to fold on a flop of J72 when OR cbets,and two people call before you? Etc etc
  • RCP Coach - Fausto ValdezRCP Coach - Fausto Valdez RCP Coach Posts: 842 ✭✭✭✭
    So @BigFarm Ure basically gonna sacrafise the ability to recoup that money through aggression post flop at a super high frequency and ure mindset is to pick up enough equity/ straight smash the flop in order to continue

    This won’t happen a lot but we dont need it to given how much dead money + ppls mistakes will make up in future profits for the time we do connect, so overall be prepare to give up a lot and attempt to maximize when we finally connect. Also it should go without saying that if ppl are deep stacked this would be a much better situation

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