10NL: AQo UTG 3x RFI, 3way Flop

Joseph FJoseph F Red Chipper Posts: 837 ✭✭✭
Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker HUD and Database Software - http://drivehud.com

NL Holdem $0.1(BB)
SB ($5.42) [VPIP: 33.5% | PFR: 11.5% | AGG: 45.8% | 3-Bet: 5.4% | Hands: 194]
BB ($46.33) [VPIP: 75.4% | PFR: 21.1% | AGG: 46.2% | 3-Bet: 21.1% | Hands: 59]
HERO ($12.64) [VPIP: 26.5% | PFR: 16.8% | AGG: 25.7% | 3-Bet: 5.3% | Hands: 41046]
CO ($16.8) [VPIP: 18.3% | PFR: 17.5% | AGG: 34.9% | 3-Bet: 8.9% | Hands: 132]
BTN ($13.16) [VPIP: 25.2% | PFR: 18.9% | AGG: 44.2% | 3-Bet: 7.3% | Hands: 256]

Dealt to Hero: Ah Qc

HERO Raises To $0.30, CO Folds, BTN Folds, SB Calls $0.25, BB Calls $0.20

Hero SPR on Flop: [5.69 effective]
Flop ($0.90): 9c Tc 5c
SB Checks, BB Bets $0.48 (Rem. Stack: 45.55), HERO ???

What would you do in this spot?

Comments

  • AlpineCurtAlpineCurt Red Chipper Posts: 55 ✭✭
    That does seem like a tricky spot.

    First, is there a case for raising bigger pre flop? You're UTG, and you want to discourage people calling with position on you. Also, you've got a very loose player in the BB that a large raise would target. I'd much rather be heads up with position on that player

    But as played, on the flop, the BB is super wide. Do you think they would donk single card flush draws? Do think they would donk weak flush draws? Straight draws? Top pair?
  • Joseph FJoseph F Red Chipper Posts: 837 ✭✭✭
    edited May 18
    AlpineCurt wrote: »
    That does seem like a tricky spot.

    First, is there a case for raising bigger pre flop? You're UTG, and you want to discourage people calling with position on you. Also, you've got a very loose player in the BB that a large raise would target. I'd much rather be heads up with position on that player

    But as played, on the flop, the BB is super wide. Do you think they would donk single card flush draws? Do think they would donk weak flush draws? Straight draws? Top pair?

    I think there's a good chance they would donk that entire range you just outlined, along with sets.

    As for the preflop sizing - Nobody opens larger than 3x in these games but that doesn't mean I shouldn't. I just usually don't on this network - it discourages too much action that's behind my range and encourages a larger 3B sizing by IP players behind me, squeezes, etc.

    The thing is: What can I realistically continue with? Kc and Ac are out there, and any Ace or Queen continues to leave me in a tricky spot, and we still have SB left to act behind us.

    (Re: Preflop sizing) On Global, with limp/calling ranges so wide, I usually open 4x from EP and there's been even more of an argument made for that by some of the CORE material I'm working through currently. Again -doesn't mean 3.5x or 4x is wrong here, though.
  • AlpineCurtAlpineCurt Red Chipper Posts: 55 ✭✭
    Joseph F wrote: »
    Nobody opens larger than 3x in these games but that doesn't mean I shouldn't.
    Correct. If everyone is using that size, that means they know how to play against it. Throw them a curve ball. Make them adjust.
    Joseph F wrote: »
    it discourages too much action that's behind my range and encourages a larger 3B sizing by IP players behind me, squeezes, etc.
    Are you sure about that? Have you tested this?

    Let's back up and look at the situation as a whole. We're trying to play correctly vs a perceived wide donking range. What specific range are you opening in this specific scenario (5 handed, UTG, vs these players, to 3x)? Be honest about what you would actually open here. There is a chance in a moment to see if you're too tight or too loose.

    If our assumption about BB having a wide donking range is correct, what does your defending range look like? What are the best hands you can call or raise (value or best bluffs) with? Do you have enough better hands to defend with in your range in this spot?

    Now, what does your defending frequency look like? Are you folding too much?

    I'm not sure about this next part, but I think vs a half pot bet from BB, we can call a little wide, especially if we think he's not just doing this with strong hands.
  • Joseph FJoseph F Red Chipper Posts: 837 ✭✭✭
    edited May 19
    Just initially: Yes I've tried to open up 4X from EP and it's indeed exploited by more frequent three betting and squeezing behind you. On this network. Many players open 2.5x from even EP so the 3x open is a nice in between.

    And are we perhaps not putting enough emphasis on what small blind may do behind me with his own ranges?

  • AlpineCurtAlpineCurt Red Chipper Posts: 55 ✭✭
    Joseph F wrote: »
    And are we perhaps not putting enough emphasis on what small blind may do behind me with his own ranges?

    Valid concern. I'm suggesting the same approach: considering the BB donk, and the SB still to act behind you, from your pre flop range, which hands would be the best to call with? Which hands, if any, would be best to raise?

    Go through each combo and see how you'd play it. There will be several, like your actual holding in this case, that are very difficult to place. It's a tedious process, but I find it works well for me and helps me visualize my whole range in this spot. If I'm worried about making what feels like a nitty fold, I can look at my entire range and see if I have enough better hands to continue with.

    In this specific spot, I think your range will just be pretty narrow. (I know this contradicts what I said earlier. I wasn't considering the SB then.) I don't think there will be many hands that you'd want to call with while still having the SB left to act.

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