Pocket Pair on JJJ board.

BartholomewBartholomew Red Chipper Posts: 13 ✭✭
1/2 NLHE at approximately 3am. 8 handed.

It's limped around to HERO(~$450), who has pocket tens in the BB. I raise to $10. (I don't remember how many limpers, but I do remember thinking I should have raised more.) HJ and SB call.

HJ(~$975) is a loose player. On his second hand, he called a preflop all-in with J10dd for his whole stack; then, made a comment about not caring about the money and wanting to have fun. He likes to gamble, and the table has become looser because of him. He's made several comments about me indicating that he respects my bets & raises.

SB(~$200) is an unknown. I've never played with him before, and haven't seen much from him at the table.

The flop comes JJJ.

SB bets $40 into a ~$30 pot.

I don't want HJ in the hand. I have a hard time figuring him out, and he's been getting the better of me. I also think SB has two overcards, and I want to force him to make a decision for his stack. With both of those things in mind, I raise it to $200.

HJ makes a comment about having a hand he doesn't think he can fold, tanks, calls.

SB folds.

HJ is going on way too much about being confused by my raise and not knowing what's going on in the hand. I suspect he has the jack or pocket queens. I don't think he has kings or aces but it's possible, and at worst, I think he's got AK although I think this is unlikely.

The turn is a 9.

I shove my remaining ~$250 into a ~$470 pot. I already decided before the turn that I was shoving unless a jack came.

If he has the jack, he's just going to take all my money. But I believe there's a nonzero percent chance that he folds queens and kings and possibly, although not likely, aces. I believe this because of the comments he's made about me and earlier plays I've made. If he doesn't have the jack, I think he'll believe I have it or aces.

What I'm wondering the most is if I should be thinking about check folding the turn here. I don't think I should be, but I don't know what I don't know.

Any and all comments welcome.

Comments

  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 2,716 -
    The element of your analysis I'm not following is why you think HJ could have QQ-AA here given the preflop action. It looks a lot more like a small pair to me. Once you make such a large flop raise I think you're pretty much committed, particularly on the blank turn.
    Moderation In Moderation
  • March422March422 Red Chipper Posts: 22 ✭✭
    Pf I think we should be going $15 here bc our raising range is going to be face up pretty tight and we want villain to pay a little more since we are oop.

    On the flop. I dont like this raise especially the sizing. If we call $40 and assume player behinds us folds there will be $110 in the pot and sb will have approx $150 left making it pretty easy to get stacks in on the turn.

    The player behind us should already be respecting the oop overbet and our call here. Given pf actions of both players i would discount PPs that beat us and AkAq so im not overly worried about protection here either. By raising to $200 here i just think we are going to push out worse PPs or own ourselves vs Jx against the big stack.
  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,160 ✭✭✭✭
    When you're raising so much, you're telling the story of TT, QQ+ for a big boat. You play face up, and it's super duper easy to play against you. (Have you realized that any lower PP is only drawing to a runner-runner quad to beat your TT? You hand is super nutted; no reason to push V out of the hand!)

    PS: as said by Kat, they NEVER have QQ+, except if they are super passive and never open.
  • BartholomewBartholomew Red Chipper Posts: 13 ✭✭
    Thanks, guys! You all made some really good points.

    1. I should have discounted QQ-AA.

    2. My preflop action should have been higher. I realized that one right after I bet.

    3. There was no reason to try to push villain out of the hand.

    I let an irrational fear of villain impact my play, and that's something I need to work on.

    I also need to learn to leave the casino when I start feeling tired because I was exhausted and obviously playing poorly.
    March422 wrote: »
    On the flop. I dont like this raise especially the sizing. If we call $40 and assume player behinds us folds there will be $110 in the pot and sb will have approx $150 left making it pretty easy to get stacks in on the turn.

    Villain is almost always calling if I just call. However, I shouldn't have been trying to push him out of the hand. I do think my sizing was bad because my reasoning for the sizing was flawed.

    I think a raise between $85-$100 keeps them both in and allows me to build the pot, which should have been my objective here.
    Red wrote: »
    When you're raising so much, you're telling the story of TT, QQ+ for a big boat. You play face up, and it's super duper easy to play against you.

    This play isn't something I normally would have done, but the game was getting pretty loose and people were calling extremely light. Otherwise, I think my plan would have been call, call, call or raise depending on the board. However, I still never should have done it because you were right that I shouldn't have tried pushing villain out.

    Thanks again, guys!
  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,160 ✭✭✭✭
    Red wrote: »
    When you're raising so much, you're telling the story of TT, QQ+ for a big boat. You play face up, and it's super duper easy to play against you.

    This play isn't something I normally would have done, but the game was getting pretty loose and people were calling extremely light. Otherwise, I think my plan would have been call, call, call or raise depending on the board. However, I still never should have done it because you were right that I shouldn't have tried pushing villain out.

    There is a critical difference between calling light (with a wide range of (meh) hands) and calling inelastic (for a too high of a price).

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