Bad play or just a cooler

ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 63 ✭✭
This hand happened at 10nl and I felt afterwards that it was a cooler but then I started to think more deeply about it and I think I could've made a better play. I haven't studied shoving very much so that could be a leak here. A little background, V2 I haven't played with before but he seemed to be a huge fish. He had lost 170bb in the short time I was playing and not in good ways. Mainly going all in on no equity bluffs etc. V1 is a good player and doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes. Some people think he's a bot because his numbers are so good. Anyway:

V1 button 140bb
V2 SB 35bb
Hero BB 120bb

Hero is dealt :6d:6S:

V1 bets 3bb
V2 3bets to 5bb (this isn't surprising he'd be doing this a lot and often with air)
Hero calls and V1 calls

Pot is 15bb

Flop:
:Ts:6c:5h

V2 checks, hero bets 7bb (my thinking was a smaller bet would get overcards, 10x and gutshots to call)
V1 calls, V2 shoves, Hero calls, V1 shoves, Hero calls,

V2 shows 1010 for a better set. V1 shows :As:5c

The rest of the board was blanks.

When V1 shoved I thought I have the best hand and what can beat me. Not the clearest of thinking at the time. But in reality there is only 3 combos that beat me at the time of the shove. So the question is did I make the right play and are there things I haven't considered that I should?

Thanks.





Comments

  • blindraiseblindraise Red Chipper Posts: 242 ✭✭
    Top set over middle set is usually a cooler. Id say its a cooler here
  • BFSkinnerBFSkinner Red Chipper Posts: 16 ✭✭
    I check and let V1 bet button then check raise to trap the field.

    Set over set at 120 bb is a cooler. Don’t overthink this until about 300bb and then it’s close.

    I would try to play more hands against V1 here as he seems to like to get it In with bottom pair.
  • Peepers288Peepers288 Red Chipper Posts: 8 ✭✭
    IMO this is a fold preflop. the 3bettor (v2), even though he is a fish, doesnt have a big enough stack for you to set mine against.
  • BFSkinnerBFSkinner Red Chipper Posts: 16 ✭✭
    Set over set on a board with likely overpairs is always a cooler unless you are very deep.

    Also, I doubt someone at 10NL is “very good”. I imagine they have significant leaks in their game playing at this level.* Pay attention to their frequencies and you will likely find the leaks.

    *Unless they are doing a Doug Polk type player doing a video challenge where they start at 2NL and move up stakes every 500 BB.
  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,231 ✭✭✭✭
    Considering V1 c-r shove with a pot size left, he could (should) do it somehow to rather wide. So just a cooler

    Good reading on V2 which line doesn't make much sens. Also even if V2 is rather tight, 66 being your 2nd best you have to call with it here (distribution based) and hope he is more on AJ/55 than TT.
  • kytmagickytmagic Red Chipper Posts: 190 ✭✭
    "V1 is a good player and doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes. Some people think he's a bot because his numbers are so good."

    How would people even KNOW that?
  • Bill SBill S Red Chipper Posts: 43 ✭✭
    V1 opening on the button with position and a solid image,
    V2 raising in SB with a sticky image and not enough behind to make set mining worth it, I probably fold PF (though i like low variance). Its likely gonna be an all with the SB by the turn so seems a bad spot to set mine.



    As played, total cooler post flop
  • ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 63 ✭✭
    kytmagic wrote: »
    "V1 is a good player and doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes. Some people think he's a bot because his numbers are so good."

    How would people even KNOW that?

    His HUD stats are excellent. Everything they tell you that you should have he has. Humans have some sort of variance i.e. they3 bet too much or too little, there is a large gap between their VPIP and PFR or something like that. This player just didn't have that. So players make assumptions. I don't know for sure. I just approach it as a good player who makes few mistakes at this level.
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 2,980 -
    ulysses27 wrote: »
    kytmagic wrote: »
    "V1 is a good player and doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes. Some people think he's a bot because his numbers are so good."

    How would people even KNOW that?

    His HUD stats are excellent. Everything they tell you that you should have he has. Humans have some sort of variance i.e. they3 bet too much or too little, there is a large gap between their VPIP and PFR or something like that. This player just didn't have that. So players make assumptions. I don't know for sure. I just approach it as a good player who makes few mistakes at this level.

    Pretty simple to develop "ideal" preflop stats. In the mid-2000s people wouldn't have been able to distinguish between me and my coach if all they had were preflop stats.
    Moderation In Moderation
  • ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 63 ✭✭
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    ulysses27 wrote: »
    kytmagic wrote: »
    "V1 is a good player and doesn't make a whole lot of mistakes. Some people think he's a bot because his numbers are so good."

    How would people even KNOW that?

    His HUD stats are excellent. Everything they tell you that you should have he has. Humans have some sort of variance i.e. they3 bet too much or too little, there is a large gap between their VPIP and PFR or something like that. This player just didn't have that. So players make assumptions. I don't know for sure. I just approach it as a good player who makes few mistakes at this level.

    Pretty simple to develop "ideal" preflop stats. In the mid-2000s people wouldn't have been able to distinguish between me and my coach if all they had were preflop stats.

    I wasnt just referring to preflop stats. But your point is taken.
  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper, Table Captain Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 2,980 -
    persuadeo wrote: »
    Looking forward to hearing what perfection looks like.

    In the case I'm thinking of it looked like the funeral of LHE.
    Moderation In Moderation
  • Doogal_DDoogal_D Red Chipper Posts: 11 ✭✭
    Peepers288 wrote: »
    IMO this is a fold preflop. the 3bettor (v2), even though he is a fish, doesnt have a big enough stack for you to set mine against.

    Villain 2's stack isn't enough to win for a set mine, but Villain 1 being in the pot makes it worth it. They've got enough behind all by themselves.

    If they're calling your shove with A5o, I can't think they're a bot. Would be interested in seeing their stats though.
    You got coolered.
  • ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 63 ✭✭
    Doogal_D wrote: »
    Peepers288 wrote: »
    IMO this is a fold preflop. the 3bettor (v2), even though he is a fish, doesnt have a big enough stack for you to set mine against.

    Villain 2's stack isn't enough to win for a set mine, but Villain 1 being in the pot makes it worth it. They've got enough behind all by themselves.

    If they're calling your shove with A5o, I can't think they're a bot. Would be interested in seeing their stats though.
    You got coolered.

    V2 isn't the bot he's the fish. V1 was accused of being a bot by other players but I have no idea. I think more importantly v1 is a very solid player that wouldn't shove with air. For me the question is what could he be shoving with. I feel I got a little too happy with my set and didn't think about that enough.

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