How many people take the flop in your $1/$3 game?

osgoboosgobo Red Chipper Posts: 62 ✭✭
Last night I decided to track the first 50 hands I played to see how many people took the flop. Here are my results for each number of players to the flop:
0= 4% of the time. Both of the times this happened there was a HUGE re-raise preflop
2= 24% of the time. Most of the time (70ish%) this happened there was a 3Bet preflop
3= 26% of the time. Most of the time (70ish%) this happened there was an open and calls
4= 28% of the time. 50/50 bet plus calls and limped around for $3 ($6 if straddle was on)
5= 14% of the time. 50/50 bet plus calls and limped around for $3 ($6 if straddle was on)
6= 4% of the time. Both times this happened someone opened and got 5 callers.

Note: I know in 3,4 and 5 there was a couple of 3Bets with callers but unfortunately I didn't log when it happened.

This seems very typical for the game I play in.

Does it seem typical of the games you play in?

If it is typical, do you think enough of your studying/ study materials focus on multi-way pots?

If this is not typical, what would you do differently, if anything, in this game?

Comments

  • sfx_beigssfx_beigs Red Chipper Posts: 69 ✭✭
    This is typical in the LA $1-3 and even 3-5 games which also play super shallow because the caps are 40-60BB depending on the room.
  • ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 114 ✭✭
    I've seen a lot of variations. But most times I see a lot of limping and then calling with multiple callers. HU is pretty rare which is ironic since so much poker training is about that. I would say a large percentage of hands are multi-way.
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 3,638 -
    edited February 7
    In terms of your own study emphasis, the critical question is how many of the pots you are involved in go multiway to the flop. You have considerable influence over whether they are multiway or not.

    The numbers seem fairly typical of a Vegas $1/$2 game.
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  • osgoboosgobo Red Chipper Posts: 62 ✭✭
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    In terms of your own study emphasis, the critical question is how many of the pots you are involved in go multiway to the flop. You have considerable influence over whether they are multiway or not.

    In late position you can have influence over whether the pots are multiway, but what do you do in early position? If you are UTG and you make it anywhere from $6 to $20 you might get 4 callers. If you start making it $25-$30 everyone just laughs and folds.
    One guy used to limp re-raise all the time in early position and now people literally yell out, "JIM LIMPED, JIM LIMPED" and then everyone laughs and limps behind.
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 3,638 -
    I would not play in a game in which players were allowed to influence the action with that sort of BS.

    Up front in these types of games I have a very narrow range.
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  • blasterblaster Red Chipper Posts: 91 ✭✭
  • EazzyEazzy Red Chipper Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭✭
    I often like to look at this from the other direction. If they call with an average range of 30% or whatever how often will it go 3 way 4 way....

    To get a fell I used an Quincunx....basically a board that drops balls over pegs that cause the ball to go to the left or right depending on how you set the pins.

    set at 75-25 they call 25% range and fold 75%


    z81oezttohdl.jpg

    divide by 10 (as I dropped 1000 balls) to get the % ..
    So you can see at 25% calling no one calls (your raise) 6.8%
    1 caller about 22,4 %
    2 callers 31.1%...
    You get the idea..

    at 30% calling range...

    aovo1a9xs7fq.png

    its is fun to play with giving different ranges that you think they call with (on average). Here the virtual Quincunx I used.

    https://www.mathsisfun.com/data/quincunx.html






  • osgoboosgobo Red Chipper Posts: 62 ✭✭
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    I would not play in a game in which players were allowed to influence the action with that sort of BS.

    It's literally, the only game in town. ... The closest game is 4ish hours away.
  • osgoboosgobo Red Chipper Posts: 62 ✭✭
    Eazzy wrote: »
    I
    To get a fell I used an Quincunx....basically a board that drops balls over pegs that cause the ball to go to the left or right depending on how you set the pins.

    Very interesting! Thanks
  • osgoboosgobo Red Chipper Posts: 62 ✭✭
    [quote="TheGameKat;c-98952"
    Up front in these types of games I have a very narrow range.[/quote]

    Can you please define what a 'very narrow range' is in this spot.
    Thanks
  • blasterblaster Red Chipper Posts: 91 ✭✭
    Up front in these types of games I have a very narrow range.
    Can you please define what a 'very narrow range' is in this spot.
    Thanks[/quote]
    Kings: a risky proposition.
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 3,638 -
    edited February 8
    osgobo wrote: »

    Can you please define what a 'very narrow range' is in this spot.
    Thanks

    UTG 9-handed with shortish stacks behind: 88+, ATs+, KQs, AQo+
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  • jeffncjeffnc Red Chipper Posts: 5,001 ✭✭✭✭✭
    In a lot of loose games it's not good for your image to be perceived too tight, especially by players who don't understand position very well. I try to do 2 things. Using GameKat's range as an example, I'm very careful of mucking hands like AJo or 77 so they don't get exposed. Instead of throwing them in, I slide them in. Also, you can play the occasional weak hand. While it isn't part of your normal range, it can be good for others to think that it is.
  • EazzyEazzy Red Chipper Posts: 1,018 ✭✭✭✭
    osgobo wrote: »
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    In terms of your own study emphasis, the critical question is how many of the pots you are involved in go multiway to the flop. You have considerable influence over whether they are multiway or not.

    In late position you can have influence over whether the pots are multiway, but what do you do in early position? If you are UTG and you make it anywhere from $6 to $20 you might get 4 callers. If you start making it $25-$30 everyone just laughs and folds.
    One guy used to limp re-raise all the time in early position and now people literally yell out, "JIM LIMPED, JIM LIMPED" and then everyone laughs and limps behind.

    The answer is not how do you get heads up here. Its to learn how to play Multi way pots. They tend to be easy to play and very profitable. Sure they can be fustrating..when you loose a few with a AA or something. But so is 3 betting AK....or 3 bet bluffing A5s when it goes wrong 3 times...or any of the many other ++EV plays good players do...

    Example....
    1-3 game. 10 handed ...mixed stack sizes...60 to 1000 I've got about 600

    I raise AA utg to 10 it goes 5 way... (sure if they will call 12 or 15 as often I start moving to that...but not to stop them from calling)

    Flop is Qh 8d 5c......

    4 players call inlcuding to 150 stacks one 60 stack and 300 stack.....one of the 120 stacls very cally does not adjust to multi way pots...

    I bet 25...(small bet probably better)....if the game was more agro checking I think is fine planning on check raising, calling or folding depending on the action_(going for my value on turn and river once I have more info)

    Turn Th

    I have a pot size bet left with 3 players calling the flop....time to get to showdown.. I check.....loose lady bets 50.....straightforard bad...goes all in 120 I fold.



    Isolate to get one bad player to call you...don't isolate to stop ok regs from playing too loose preflop...just learn to play multi way pots...

    TheGameKat wrote: »
    I would not play in a game in which players were allowed to influence the action with that sort of BS.

    Up front in these types of games I have a very narrow range.

    I tend to start playing more hands in games where players play loose preflop and badly straightforward post flop from early positon....as long as no one is squeezing...

    small pairs become great for a small raise as long as not a lot of short stacks(as I make 3 to 4 bb raises with my entier range. they go multi way fit or fold....if I hit better chance to get paid off...

    Suited broadways and big suited connectors....if you hit a draw...players tend to overvalue your 2 barrell bluffs...get more profitable...As your playing bigger flush draws jts bet bet check will sometimes win agenst 64s....though you never have 64s against jts.....and of course if you hit your bigger flush draw....ka ching..




  • ulysses27ulysses27 Red Chipper Posts: 114 ✭✭
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    In terms of your own study emphasis, the critical question is how many of the pots you are involved in go multiway to the flop. You have considerable influence over whether they are multiway or not.

    The numbers seem fairly typical of a Vegas $1/$2 game.

    When you say considerable influence do you mean whether to actually play in those hands or not or are you referring to how much you raise in multiple limped hands?
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 3,638 -
    ulysses27 wrote: »
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    In terms of your own study emphasis, the critical question is how many of the pots you are involved in go multiway to the flop. You have considerable influence over whether they are multiway or not.

    The numbers seem fairly typical of a Vegas $1/$2 game.

    When you say considerable influence do you mean whether to actually play in those hands or not or are you referring to how much you raise in multiple limped hands?

    Both. If you play tight up front and make large punishing raises over limpers in LP you play fewer multiway pots.

    Incidentally, concerning jeff's point about the dangers of appearing tight in these games, if you blaze away from CO/BTN you won't be perceived as tight, particularly when you stack someone with a "bad" hand.
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  • jeffncjeffnc Red Chipper Posts: 5,001 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 11
    TheGameKat wrote: »
    Incidentally, concerning jeff's point about the dangers of appearing tight in these games, if you blaze away from CO/BTN you won't be perceived as tight, particularly when you stack someone with a "bad" hand.

    That's a fair point. We are after all talking about people who don't play that well, e.g. pay attention to position.

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