Outside the box preflop sizing

ROI RUINERROI RUINER Red Chipper Posts: 203 ✭✭
Anyone that plays on ACR knows light 3betting is a religion on there. So I experimented over a 1282 hand sample on 10nl blitz today with some very unorthodox preflop sizing. A little later I’ll post some hand examples but it really worked out in my favor as far as how the session went and how less often I was 3bet.

At first it was just creating folds and players playing back when they had stuff like JJ+.AK-AQ.

I’m one of the regs on there as well as known from 2+2 to play on there so I know it was throwing the other regs off and they weren’t sure how to react to it. I would go 7-9bbs from every position with any hand in my opening range.

After a while I started getting more callers with what I assume are wider ranges so I started making adjustments solely based on position (tighter EP and looser LP).

I finished the session with a 20.48bb/100 winrate.

Post flop it was great because the SPR was lower and there was more commitment to draws along with larger cbets and the pots were significantly bigger. Towards the end of the session I really tightened up my ranges and went on a pretty decent run. All in all it was a great session.

I feel like my play has been robotic and text book for months now and wanted to try something different. It felt like I had an edge because players had to adjust to me and my play.


  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,253 ✭✭✭✭
    ROI RUINER wrote: »
    I would go 7-9bbs from every position with any hand in my opening range.
    This seems huge, esp. for online play. If you're playing micro/low stakes, I guess they assume "big bet = big hand" and overfold (as you pointed out, "playing back only with JJ+/AQ+). And as you pointed out, this makes postflop easier because lower SPR.

    Yet even if you're are winning money at this stakes, this doesn't mean it's a sound strategy.
    • Better players notice and note such unusual openbet sizing; and they will adjust and fight back. Meaning you often will have either to lower your bet sizing (lowering your risk) and quitting this strategy or tightening up your range (turning you into a nit).
    • Also even if +EV at your stakes, I'm not even sure it's maxEV. Some players esp. low stakes ones like to chase / call down with 2nd best. So with your actual strategy you can steal a first bigger bet, but I think it blocks you to play for stacks - hence you might not be maxEV as you might let value on the table.
    • Finally, a bigger bet means theoretically a tighter range: bigger bet = more risk = need more equity to be +EV. This means that you have to open a much tighter range by opening 7-9bb as you would by opening 2.5-3bb or even 4-5bb. (This is through this issue that good players will counterattack you.) Sure, you can construct two open ranges, one with a big sizing as you do and the other with a more "natural" sizing - but IMHO you will complexify uselessly your strategy as you'll have a hard time balancing everything on every streets.
  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper Posts: 4,268 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Anytime an opponent doesn't have an answer to a particular line, there is a short term benefit. How quickly they adjust to you depends on their skill level.
  • RyanH1995RyanH1995 Red Chipper Posts: 75 ✭✭
    While Im sure this strategy confused the player pool I don't know how sustainable it is. The better players will take notice of this pretty quickly and will most likely not have a flatting range and just 3bet or fold and maybe even jam over a 7-9bb open. Even the weaker players will pick up on this and may not know how to react properly but they will probably tighten up considerably making it much harder to get value with the top of your range. Yes you will win a larger pot with a larger raise size but you have so many hands that do not want to play a bloated pot.

    Look at a button opening range which is usually something like 40% of hands. Theoretically if you are using a 7-9bb opening size you would have to open far fewer hands here so you lose the opportunity to steal the blinds with a lot of weak hands. If you still open 40% of hands with this size you will be playing a large pot with a ton of hands like small PP, suited connectors that prefer to play at a higher SPR. You also lose significantly more when you have to give up and fold on later streets.
  • ROI RUINERROI RUINER Red Chipper Posts: 203 ✭✭
    Lots of good comments and as the session went on the outcome is in line with the comments.

    My BU opening range was about 30%. I didn’t stick to standard BU and CO ranges as stated. I still played wide from the SB.

    The hardest decisions came when I connected with the flop but not strong. For instance opening K8s from the CO and catching TP or middle pair. It was pretty much a delayed cbet one and done strategy with a top pair and cbet for protection IP when checked to then one and done with a middle pair on the flop. Having position in those spots helps a lot. So I was pretty exploitable if anyone was paying attention but since it was fast fold it wasn’t as likely. Player pool was about 170 players.

    Also HUD stats on other players had an effect on the range I played. If there was a 40%VPIP acting after me I adjusted knowing they want to see a flop and are more likely to not be concerned with the price.

    I unexpectedly got called back to work for a few days so haven’t had a chance to post any hands but there were some interesting spots I want to post. Hopefully I get a chance to tonight.

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file