Was my thought process even remotely close? AK vs 2 players

betamax30betamax30 Red Chipper Posts: 6 ✭✭
I'm a brand new player studying core, but also currently watching the Ed Miller Course companion videos. Had specifically had the skill of 'not paying people off if they raise big on the turn and river' in my mind during this hand.

This was the 9th hand and I didn't have much prior information on either player, but the MP limper had played 5 hands and had folded all on the flop, the SB had played two previous hands.

Pacific Poker - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

BB: 174.8 BB
UTG: 110.4 BB
MP: 105.4 BB - Loose Passive?
Hero (CO): 109.8 BB
BTN: 70.2 BB
SB: 124 BB - Unknown but had thought of as LAG from two previous hands.

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has :Kh:Ad
fold, MP calls 1 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, fold, SB calls 3.6 BB, fold, MP calls 3 BB

Is my bet sizing too small here for an iso raise? Should I have gone higher?

Flop : (13 BB, 3 players) :Kd:3d:9s
SB checks, MP bets 6.4 BB, Hero raises to 19.2 BB, SB calls 19.2 BB, fold

I feel I'm ahead here even with two players as the board is dry, and re-raise for value and for protection against the flush draw. The loose passive from MP folds, but the small blind calls. I think he could have trip 9s, trip 3s, but also a lot of straight and flush combinations. I'm new to thinking in ranges, so happy to be corrected.

Turn : (57.8 BB, 2 players) :5c
SB bets 19 BB, Hero calls 19 BB

Turn is a blank, but SB leads out for a less than half pot raise. This is where my thought process started to go wrong. Looking at it now, I think he probably has some kind of draw and is setting a price to see the next card. At the time, I was thinking likely monster.

This is where I need to improve my thinking in ranges. It's hard for me at the moment to visualise quickly how often I'd be ahead. I check here, but I think I would re-raise if this spot were to happen again.


River : (95.8 BB, 2 players) :Qd
SB bets 47.8 BB, fold

Turn is a Qd. Any diamond flush draw gets home, as does J10 for the straight, and there are still trips possible. I can't beat any of the hands he's repping. Opponent bets half pot, and I fold.

SB wins 91.2 BB

So my questions are - am I thinking about this hand in the right way, and what sort of frameworks should I have to help make those decisions in future?

Many thanks and please provide any feedback on how I've posted the hand for future - if there are any style aspects that I should change.

Cheers!

Comments

  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,430 ✭✭✭✭✭
    betamax30 wrote: »
    the SB had played two previous hands.
    SB: 124 BB - Unknown but had thought of as LAG from two previous hands.
    You're very probably overestimating SB. The last 2 hands he was BU and CO aka the best positions. That he played them both in the last orbit doesn't give much info.

    Also "LAG" doesn't mean "loose player" but "loose aggressive player". There have (big) differences with loose passive players.
    But again, hard to tell anything from these 2 hands in a 6-max game.
    betamax30 wrote: »
    Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has :Kh:Ad
    fold, MP calls 1 BB, Hero raises to 4 BB, fold, SB calls 3.6 BB, fold, MP calls 3 BB

    Is my bet sizing too small here for an iso raise? Should I have gone higher?

    It's fine. Low stakes live would demand to go bigger, but as online sizing it's perfectly fine.
    You could size slightly bigger if the players still to act tend to be sticky : make them pay the flop.
    betamax30 wrote: »
    Flop : (13 BB, 3 players) :Kd:3d:9s
    SB checks, MP bets 6.4 BB, Hero raises to 19.2 BB, SB calls 19.2 BB, fold

    I feel I'm ahead here even with two players as the board is dry, and re-raise for value and for protection against the flush draw. The loose passive from MP folds, but the small blind calls. I think he could have trip 9s, trip 3s, but also a lot of straight and flush combinations. I'm new to thinking in ranges, so happy to be corrected.
    That's right. Very often such lead are with marginal hands - like TP bad kicker, MP or a marginal draw. So raising is good - make them respect you !
    (If he re-raises, considering his profile, then it's an easy fold.)

    Yet I'd sized much bigger - for a pot size bet aka 25.8bb. I don't like to give too goods of pot odds.
    (And I'd overbet shove turn).
    betamax30 wrote: »
    Turn : (57.8 BB, 2 players) :5c
    SB bets 19 BB, Hero calls 19 BB
    Turn is a blank, but SB leads out for a less than half pot raise. This is where my thought process started to go wrong. Looking at it now, I think he probably has some kind of draw and is setting a price to see the next card. At the time, I was thinking likely monster.

    This is where I need to improve my thinking in ranges. It's hard for me at the moment to visualise quickly how often I'd be ahead. I check here, but I think I would re-raise if this spot were to happen again.
    • This card is a pure brick. So SB cannot rep a draw of any kind which completed - not even a weird gutshot. And a 5 doesn't help his value range (should not) - let alone his range : 5c only improves... Ks5s and Kh5h ?
    • Also if SB wanted to take the lead, why not c-r flop?
    • And why 1/3 pot ?! This is a bet sizing uncommonly used in low stakes IMHO - even more as donkbet bet sizing.
    His line is bizarre... Hard to believe of anything.

    Out of the blue, I'd let my inner spewy monkey talk and just shove into SB. Most of times (?) we put a tremendous pressure on marginal made hands and draws - they may even call thinking we are going nuts; or because they are unable to fold their draw or marginal TP (hooray for us!)

    Sometimes we may crash against a strangely played 55 or 99 (or weird K5). It's fine, because this will work +EV for us in the long run: we gathered info about V's hand and how he played, we set up an aggro image which we can then use later one.
    vowtb14whber.jpg
    Even @SplitSuit told me during my live coaching with him several years ago that he could burn few buy-in in the first orbits, to win them back with interest later in the session.
  • BFSkinnerBFSkinner Red Chipper Posts: 153 ✭✭
    As played, you show aggression on the flop and then the SB leads 33% pot into you on the turn. This seems fishy and my inclination is to shove the turn, however; I do not play these stakes enough to know if small fishy bets into aggression are big hands.

    I don't think you can ever call the river.
  • betamax30betamax30 Red Chipper Posts: 6 ✭✭
    Brilliant, thank you both for your advice. It's the first time I've properly thought out a hand like this, and it's great to see the additional assumptions or thoughts that you're making for those decisions.

    Cheers!
  • TheGameKatTheGameKat Posts: 4,070 -
    I have nothing to add to the excellent analysis, but does anyone know if that's the same Pacific Poker that was around in the early 2000s???
    Moderation In Moderation

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