A2s from BB

StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
http://www.boomplayer.com/en/poker-hands/Boom/16923278_6FAE11269D

Here with A2 suited, how I had to play all streets opponent believe that I hit their draws?
He had entered the river ALL SO? fold for value?
Or this limit such bluffs do not catch?

Comments

  • OddAndyOddAndy Red Chipper Posts: 39 ✭✭
    The turn bet is questionable, because his range is unlikely to fold. You are trying to represent the diamond flush there (?) but he is never folding.
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    OddAndy wrote: »
    The turn bet is questionable, because his range is unlikely to fold. You are trying to represent the diamond flush there (?) but he is never folding.

    Yes, but as you see your opponent is stable Reg and mixes his game raises as with the best hands and with less playable, I guess my bluff flush draw, beat most of the range which would continue bet on the river?
  • JfdiwinsJfdiwins Red Chipper Posts: 52
    I personally really don't like the check call flop - donk bet turn line not just in your hand but in any hand. I always see it as being very specific for example with a set on a dry flop out of position on the flop and then the turn card changes the board texture or we hit a disguised hand on the turn which we can get value with.

    A check call flop - donk turn line is used a lot as a bluff and is more likely to get called unless the bet size is very large. Your turn bet size is .40 into .71 so the villain is getting nearly 3-1 to call in a small pot.

    In your hand if you had a strong flush draw on the flop or with your gut shot you COULD consider a check raise particularly if the villain continuation bets a lot however the villain is in MP and could still have a strong range here which has over pairs in it that they are never folding. Had you check raised the c-bet then donk bet the turn nearer pot size then your hand looks much more like the flush and is more likely to get folds. In your hand you are unfortunate in the villain hits top pair on the turn and isn't going to fold.

    I would suggest that you look at the range that you defend with pre flop in the BB vs an MP open if the player is tight, as you are out of position throughout the hand and will need to hit a big hand to be happy post flop. How confident can you be on any ace high flop with A2s for top pair no kicker?

    My calling range out of position vs a tight MP player starts around Ace Ten suited in the blinds at NL20 and I have stats around 24/20 so I am not the tightest.

    At 0.02/0.05 you should bluff rarely as the mistake players make at the lower levels is calling too much. Look to bet for value with made hands rather than bluffing. I play at 20NL and still find players call too much out of curiosity and not wanting to be bluffed.
  • JfdiwinsJfdiwins Red Chipper Posts: 52
    Hi Stefan,
    I have posted about the check call flop/donk turn line in the general concepts forum which should gain some more feedback that may interest you.
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    Jfdiwins wrote: »
    Hi Stefan,
    I have posted about the check call flop/donk turn line in the general concepts forum which should gain some more feedback that may interest you.


    Something you blinds- 88-22, A9s-A5s, KJs-K4s, Q8s+, J7s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 65s, 54s, ATo-A6o, K9o+, QTo+, JTo, T9o


    VPIP- 22 : PFR- 17; AFq- 67 my looks , but over the game acquires other features
    31/23 / AFq- 60 one hours play so one way ))))


    Thank you very much!
  • TuffTuff Red Chipper Posts: 148 ✭✭
    edited December 2015
    How about raise preflop to 0.60 and when get called.. donk 1$ on this paired board
    My SSD is faster then your HDD ---
  • Rello242Rello242 Red Chipper Posts: 595 ✭✭
    Not a fan of the donk, but to me if your going to donk turn then follow up on the river. More importantly though, if you are going to bluff, i like raising the flop better. Lets be honest, i rather invest 0.40 cents more to his 0.20 cents bet on the flop and look stronger than to call 0.20 and bet 0.60 and look weaker.
    -Rello

    "Its better to give than to receive, so bet more and call less"
    Check out my HUSNG Graph: Chips-Results
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  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    I would tribetna do0.6 if the raise came from late position, my mistake is another that checked the flop and missed playing bluff
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    Rello242 wrote: »
    Not a fan of the donk, but to me if your going to donk turn then follow up on the river. More importantly though, if you are going to bluff, i like raising the flop better. Lets be honest, i rather invest 0.40 cents more to his 0.20 cents bet on the flop and look stronger than to call 0.20 and bet 0.60 and look weaker.

    +1
  • TuffTuff Red Chipper Posts: 148 ✭✭
    edited December 2015
    How did he get that 15$ stack? Did you pay attention wich hands he plays? Whats his image? I don't think this is a nit and has a wider opening range with his bigger stack so preflop 3bet to 0.60 makes you a lot stronger to continue on the flop and rep a big pair.

    You don't want to 3bet him.....why?
    Does this answer justify a call?

    I think its better to 3bet your Small Suited Ace here from the blinds then calling. So i would 3bet preflop or just fold.
    My SSD is faster then your HDD ---
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    edited December 2015
    Tuff wrote: »
    How did he get that 15$ stack? Did you pay attention wich hands he plays? Whats his image? I don't think this is a nit and has a wider opening range with his bigger stack so preflop 3bet to 0.60 makes you a lot stronger to continue on the flop and rep a big pair.

    You don't want to 3bet him.....why?
    Does this answer justify a call?

    I think its better to 3bet your Small Suited Ace here from the blinds then calling. So i would 3bet preflop or just fold.



    Later in the game , he four -bet me with aces.
    I just replied coldly with AK .
    The river got its 100 bb came because of all the chips I had ace high straight

    http://www.boomplayer.com/en/poker-hands/Boom/16923386_F551757E70
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    You played her hand , a bit like bot) )))
  • JfdiwinsJfdiwins Red Chipper Posts: 52
    Hi Stefan
    You wrote:
    "Something you blinds- 88-22, A9s-A5s, KJs-K4s, Q8s+, J7s+, T8s+, 97s+, 86s+, 75s+, 65s, 54s, ATo-A6o, K9o+, QTo+, JTo, T9o


    VPIP- 22 : PFR- 17; AFq- 67 my looks , but over the game acquires other features
    31/23 / AFq- 60 one hours play so one way ))))"

    This would mean you are defending 31.2% vs a MP opening range which could be around 15-20% for an average REG player (assuming you are 3 betting 99+/AJ+ and there are no 3 bet bluffs included in these stats).

    A tighter TAG defending range in the big blind vs MP MAY look similar to:
    22-JJ, AQ+/KQs+/AJs+, 3 betting QQ+/AK for value and using ATs/AJ/KJS/KQ as 3 bet bluffs with the intention of folding to a 4 bet. Ranges can vary with some players preferring not to defend the smaller pocket pairs 22-55. This would be defending 11-13% of hands vs a 15-20% opening range where we will be out of position through out the hand.

    The range is not set in stone it is just to give you an idea of what a tight player MAY defend vs a REG MP open. You quoted stats of 22/17 so I would suggest the tighter defending range would be more suited to 22/17. If you end up at 31/23 it sounds like you are calling/defending the blinds a lot.

    I would also suggest 3 betting 99/TT for value in the blinds vs a REG in MP may be a little bit too loose?

    I hope this helps.
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    So, if we blind someone with 22/17 statistics say, does this mean that if we raise from the button or cut-off and the player the call
      then expect a narrow range?
    Also cast in often if there is no hand right?

    What does aggression factor in statistics
      and if the player has to say for example statistics 31/27/60
       it means you play that many hands aggressively?
    And what type would you define this player?
    thank you!
  • JfdiwinsJfdiwins Red Chipper Posts: 52
    Hi Stefan,
    Sorry I am struggling to understand your questions. I hope the following helps:
    A player who is 22/17 plays 22% of hands and raises 17% of the 22%. It doesn't mean they play 22% in all positions. So in early position they may open as little as 12% , mid position 15% , cut off 22% , button 50% etc.

    A player who is 31/27 isn't calling much and probably doesn't defend their blinds wide. It still doesn't tell you how much they open with in mid position. You will need the positional information for this. The raise first in stat would be more useful for the 31/27 player to see how much they raise by position.

    Your suggested range is nearer a range to use vs the button than vs mid position. In 6 max I see players opening as little as 12% in mid position and playing almost any 2 cards from the button in an unopened pot so their button raise is nearer a 70% range.

    31/27 would be loose aggressive and is playing a raise/ fold style very rarely calling but stealing a lot in unopened pots. It will depend on the size of the hand sample though.

    A player calling with 22/17 starts is generally speaking cold calling with a tight range normally pocket pairs and some of the better suited Broadway type hands.
  • StefanStefan Red Chipper Posts: 34
    edited December 2015
    Jfdiwins wrote: »
    Hi Stefan,
    Sorry I am struggling to understand your questions. I hope the following helps:
    A player who is 22/17 plays 22% of hands and raises 17% of the 22%. It doesn't mean they play 22% in all positions. So in early position they may open as little as 12% , mid position 15% , cut off 22% , button 50% etc.

    A player who is 31/27 isn't calling much and probably doesn't defend their blinds wide. It still doesn't tell you how much they open with in mid position. You will need the positional information for this. The raise first in stat would be more useful for the 31/27 player to see how much they raise by position.

    Your suggested range is nearer a range to use vs the button than vs mid position. In 6 max I see players opening as little as 12% in mid position and playing almost any 2 cards from the button in an unopened pot so their button raise is nearer a 70% range.

    31/27 would be loose aggressive and is playing a raise/ fold style very rarely calling but stealing a lot in unopened pots. It will depend on the size of the hand sample though.

    A player calling with 22/17 starts is generally speaking cold calling with a tight range normally pocket pairs and some of the better suited Broadway type hands.

    You are awesome))) thanks!

    31/27/66 Do not fall to the LAG style? which use controlled aggression ? or simply tilt ))))

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