Hand I busted a tourney today with. Is a fold justified on the flop or turn?

broseidonbroseidon Red Chipper Posts: 7

Hey guys so I think I played this hand correctly but just wanted to see if I could justify a fold on the flop or turn? My image was pretty tight as I had only played a few hands in the last couple hours and only showed down aa, and villain knew this. Villain was a lag who was on a rush, he was playing pretty much every hand and was very aggressive so I had him on a very wide range. With the raise on the flop maybe something like jq, all flush draws, 55, and any straight draw. With that range I figured I was ahead of his range on the turn and with a fairly low spr I figured a shove was the best play. I haven't gotten back home to do any actual calculations with it but I'd love to hear what others think.


  • philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
    i think it would have been hard to fold on the turn given villains image, alarm bells may have started ringing with the min raise on the flop people with big draws usually raise bigger trying to get some fold equity not a size that screams for a call but dunno if i would have played it any different to how u had if i was in the moment, its easy to say how it should have been played when watching it as a replay though lol
  • FilthyCasualFilthyCasual Red Chipper Posts: 871 ✭✭✭
    edited March 2016
    With the hot streak / lag image, 4.5 SPR, and TPTK, I don't think it's a horrible stack off, but that min check-raise you really need to consider how good a single pair is against it. If the villain was seemingly trying to win pots more than win chips, I don't think it's an easy fold.

    Turn raise was curious, villain needs to call 13400 to see 54100, 24.7% so the FD isn't quite getting the odds to call assuming it's not a combo, but I wouldn't blame someone in a tournament for making the call. I just don't think we have much FE
  • broseidonbroseidon Red Chipper Posts: 7
    thanks a lot for the inputs guys, after having a night to sleep on it and thinking about it today, i dont think hes ever folding there either, he had something like 130k behind still and i just dont think he would fold with the range i put him on, therefore i probably should have folded.

    pretty much the same situation happened today though and im not sure if i played it scared or if it was the right move. for this hand it was in an online tournament. the data is below.

    SB: 89.01 BB (VPIP: 28.85, PFR: 11.76, 3Bet Preflop: 3.85, Hands: 52)
    BB: 35.74 BB (VPIP: 9.09, PFR: 6.06, 3Bet Preflop: 6.25, Hands: 33)
    UTG: 45.6 BB (VPIP: 18.61, PFR: 10.09, 3Bet Preflop: 3.30, Hands: 234)
    UTG+1: 90.31 BB (VPIP: 21.15, PFR: 17.31, 3Bet Preflop: 4.00, Hands: 52)
    MP: 87.75 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 40)
    Hero (MP+1): 143.35 BB
    CO: 47.27 BB (VPIP: 28.28, PFR: 22.70, 3Bet Preflop: 5.77, Hands: 146)
    BTN: 66.4 BB (VPIP: 27.03, PFR: 9.59, 3Bet Preflop: 2.44, Hands: 74)

    8 players post ante of 0.1 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

    Pre Flop: (pot: 2.3 BB) Hero has As Qh
    fold, fold, MP raises to 3.47 BB, Hero calls 3.47 BB, fold, fold, fold, fold

    Flop : (9.25 BB, 2 players) 9h Th Qd
    MP bets 6.16 BB, Hero raises to 12.33 BB, MP raises to 84.17 BB and is all-in, fold

    MP wins 33.9 BB

    I folded thinking that it was roughly a coinflip situation or im just beat by something like kj, i figured there would be better spots later and wasnt worth the risk so early. was i playing scared just because something similar happened yesterday or is it the right call?
  • JesseJesse Red Chipper Posts: 134 ✭✭
    Why did you shove the turn? If you called and consider folding the river, you'd still have >10 BB.

    Are you trying to extract max value from KQ or QT or something?
  • broseidonbroseidon Red Chipper Posts: 7
    i shoved the turn because due to this player who was raising pretty much every hand to something like 2000 had made the effective stacks much smaller, i felt like a call would have effectively crippled me unless i got lucky and caught a monster. i thought it was pretty much a push or fold situation and i assumed i would get some fold equity out of at least half of his range with the push. turns out i now dont think that he was folding any of his range and therefore i probably should have folded. not sure my train of thought was correct there but that was what i was thinking at the moment.

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