Bad turn card bad fold

philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
I played live poker the other day and had been at the table for about an hour so far playing 2-4 no I was dealt pocket aces in seat 3 I raised to 20 and got 3 callers cut off button and bb flop comes k 9 3 rainbow I c bet for 60 cut off and button fold and the bb who was an unknown raises to 190 I flat he's raise fearing he could have a set maybe k9 for two pair turn card was another King and villain bets $200 I folded fairly quickly and showed my aces and he showed me 2 3 off suit it was unfortunate the King repeated because I think I would have called him down playing my aces as a bluff catcher but I'm wondering is this wrong to be playing such a strong hand like this when get raised on the flop or should I have re raised he's raise on the flop and tried to get stacks in

Comments

  • SplitSuitSplitSuit RCP Coach Posts: 4,070 -
    Phil, can you please start formatting your posts so they are easier to read? I know it takes a few extra minutes, but it helps get responses so that your posts don't look like scary walls of text. Just click the spade icon while writing your post to choose cards...

    A better example of your post would be:

    $2/$4 NL

    I was in seat 3 and deal :As:Ah

    I open to $20, 3 callers (CO, BUT, BB)

    Flop ($80): :Ks:9h:3c

    BB check, I CB $60, CO fold, BUT fold, BB raises to $190 (he's totally unknown)

    I flat.

    Turn ($460): :Kc

    BB bets $200, I fold

    (rest of information here)
    📑 Grab my custom poker spreadsheet pack right now.
    📘 Start the Preflop & Math Poker Workbook today.
  • philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
    That definitely does look a lot better just one thing I tried to insert the cards via I phone but it would not let me insert all cards don't know if this is an isolated case as I did read someone post something similar on the forum about an issue using I phone to insert cards into forum
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just looks like a really terrible bluff to me by your villain. He is raising a relatively dry board after you bet into 3 people (75%) pot. He is representing very little because you block AK. I think its correct just to call down and let him continue his bluff. It is a very unfortunate card because some live players do over play KJ and KQ here this way some of the time. If the board was a little more wet say :Ks:9s:3c , I would be more worried about sets or combo draws that have good equity against :As:Ah .
  • SplitSuitSplitSuit RCP Coach Posts: 4,070 -
    philby20 wrote: »
    That definitely does look a lot better just one thing I tried to insert the cards via I phone but it would not let me insert all cards don't know if this is an isolated case as I did read someone post something similar on the forum about an issue using I phone to insert cards into forum

    While we try to fix that issue, know you can always manually add a card by using the following recipe:

    :RANKsuit

    so colonKd = :Kd
    📑 Grab my custom poker spreadsheet pack right now.
    📘 Start the Preflop & Math Poker Workbook today.
  • Jimmy3150Jimmy3150 Red Chipper Posts: 362 ✭✭
    I think you needed to have more of a plan with this hand went it went multi-way and how you were going to react if raised / check-raised on the flop. I don't like the call the flop / fold the turn line ... Seems you are just reacting to his aggression. If you had the read that you're beat on the flop then there's no point in wasting another $130 to see a turn card which improves you a small % of the time.

    What were stack sizes here? Check SPR next time to see if you should be stacking this off on the flop. As always this is clearly villain dependent.
  • philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
    It's a rough guess but I think stacks were about 800 at the start of the hand so would have been a small spr by the turn. it was something I failed to consider well in the hand I just took he's aggression on the flop as top pair or sets then when the k repeated I figured I was now loosing to the hands I assigned on flop but I see how having a plan going into the hand would have made things much easier instead of just re acting to villains actions
  • BenLeewoodBenLeewood Red Chipper Posts: 285 ✭✭
    I like Jimmy's point about having a plan. When you got 3 callers, you have to plan what you would do on a non threatening flop. This was a great flop for you. A set of 9's could be out there but you'll just have to pay him off. You can't go looking for monsters under the bed. Especially when we have such good +EV.

    So I like your $60 C-Bet. Almost as much as I like seeing the folds that followed. But I love the villians raise the most!!! I would hate to see a flat call from him. That would make me go into pot control mode and possibly start dreaming up some scary monsters. When the King came on the turn, .I'd just try to get to showdown cheap or fold to any huge bets.

    But this Villian gave you the green light to take charge. I'm shoving right then. I'll sleep fine if he snap calls me with an unlikely set or 2 pair. Your decisions will only get harder on the turn and river so why not just make a stand here.

    Here's why I would shove:

    1). You could get a hero call with weak holdings like :Kh:Th or :KC: :QH which would make you a big favorite to win a huge pot

    2). You don't need to evaluate the turn and river (which we can all agree was not a good card for you). It gave him the perfect bluff opportunity and since he leads out, he takes control. Which is why he floated you in the first place.

    3). Other then flopping quads or a set....on a very dry board.....what else could you ask for here on the flop? This is a perfect situation to get all the chips in.

    4). You give him a lot of fold equity. It's ok if he snap folds in my mind. Sure I lost some value, but with that turn and whatever was coming on the river, that would have been some tense poker no matter what card turns. It's still a pretty decent pot.

    5). Your table image is much improved. All opponents will see that your not afraid to put THEM to the test. A hand like this gets noticed. For all they know you're on a stone bluff. But they won't know what you have when the Villian folds. Your stock as a tough player goes up big time here.

    Here's why I wouldn't shove:

    1). I'm scared of monsters under the bed :KH :9H: or a set. (In this case, I'm folding. Never flat calling the flop bet).

    I like the reasoning for shoving better then not shoving. Calling is out of the question.

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