JTs vs the 3-bet

dcenterdcenter Red Chipper Posts: 52
Home game, $1/2 NL. Winding down for the night. Straddled pot, with a standard straddle, so it is $4 to go for our Hero (if you wanna call me that), who is first to act with JT of clubs. Hero has $109 behind and opens for $17, called by MP, and button. Straddler 3-bets to $75.

I am seen as fairly tight at the table, but I had just sat down after winning the tournament about 45 minutes earlier and we were on the last couple of rounds of play. Most know that I don't play utg without strong hands, and I was trying to semi-bluff pre-flop, and steal the blinds.

The big question I have is what to do now. The guy who 3-bet is a great guy, not a great player. He might do this with as little as a medium pocket pair. I do expect his range to be pair heavy, probably not AJ or worse, and only suited AQ. He could always have the nuts too:) I don't think he pays enough attention to notice anything about my stack size, he just plays his cards. The other two guys probably have good hands, maybe speculative, but I don't expect them to call the overbet without premium premium hands. I expect them to fold in other words.

In the end, I raised all in. Both MP and button folded and Villain called, showing AKo.

two clubs and a king on the flop, king on the turn, junk on the river with a distinct shortage of clubs.

Villain wins, Hero hangs his head in shame.

Opening was probably a mistake, but I give myself a few loose opens a night, and this was one. Should I have called the 3-bet? Was the shove bad? I really want to understand how right or wrong it was, aside from whether I should have been in the spot or not.

Thank you,

Dave

Comments

  • GabeyJGabeyJ Red Chipper Posts: 436 ✭✭✭
    Why do you think opening J10s in Ep was bad? It was but it would prob be better for you to try and find out the why? And your shove is basically pointless since OR can
    Never fold and you are just straight up gambling trying to hit a flop
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I use to fold all these SCs in EP but started playing JTs+ in my game to balance my range of possible holdings. Rather then 22+ AQ+ type hands there are very few hands I can represent post flop. Really depends on the game though. If its an aggressive game I am likely to just dump it. I am either limping with 22-88 and JTs+ or making a tiny 5x open rather than face an isolation since they dont like to 3bet with out premium pairs.

    Onto the hand. You are shallow stack at just under 55bb so I am either just calling the $4 straddle or folding. Looking to save my stack to apply some pressure post flop rather then go 4 ways in a bloated pot with a 1-2 SPR.

    Most of these SCs are played in LP so its more likely you have position post flop and can apply some pressure. Its hard to get free cards or evaluate opponents oop.
  • tagliustaglius Red Chipper Posts: 290 ✭✭
    his 3bet is sooooo big that he has committed himself to calling a shove. So when you shove, you know you are going to get called 100% - with a hand that is at best 45% to win against a small pair, 40% against AK/AQ, and like 18% against overpairs. You're 100% getting it in as an underdog with no fold equity.

    So shove is unprofitable. Calling is equally so - you're creating a tiny SPR that people will feel they have to call even when they miss with ace high.

    The only profitable play is to fold. It sucks when you try a little preflop steal or bluff and someone 3bets you, but you need to be disciplined enough to just smile and let it go.
  • dcenterdcenter Red Chipper Posts: 52
    Taglius,

    I agree that the 3 bet was huge compared to my stack, and my shove was only because I had no chips left and it was the end of the night. I knew I was getting the extra shove chips in bad with no chance to get a fold, so not only was it a dumb play, it was truly a dumb question, and I already knew the answer. That means the big question is, how did my call stand up to the range of hands that he might have, and with the pot odds that I was getting, exactly how good or bad was the call. In the end I was risking $109 to win $146. That is 1.38 to 1. I think that is enough to call against the AK/AQ, assuming your above figures are correct, but what about the whole picture?

    DC
  • SullySully Red Chipper Posts: 731 ✭✭✭
    Equilab is free. It will help you answer your question

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