030 - Stop Min-Cashing and Start Shipping More

We're celebrating our 30th podcast episode with an in-depth discussion featuring coaches Doug Hull and Gareth James on how to win more tournaments.

Take a listen and let us know how you approach shoving to win.

Red Chip Poker

Comments

  • philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
    Hi i listened to your podcast the other day and was inspired to go and download some push fold charts and paste them on the wall next to the computer, anyway i have been looking them over and these charts are for shoving up to 20bbs which seems like a lot for example shoving 20bbs and antes with q9s from the hi jack seat kinda scares the shit out of me if this was a 10k buy in event or even a lot less 20bbs just seems like i still have some flexibility to have an exit strategy if thinks go bad ect, am i being to nitty here, i'm fine with shoving at 10bbs but 20bbs is a huge difference, also would it make much of a difference when in the latter stages of the tournament when most players only have 20 to 30 bbs left and everyone is just min raising there value hands or is the shoving mainly for early to middle stages once you have become the short stack.
  • GazelligGazellig RCP Coach Posts: 74 ✭✭
    There are some really good questions here so I'll do my best to answer them. My advice is to focus on shove spots when you have <15bb. In soft fields, shoving for anything more than that is a bit unnecessary. Of course there are times when shoving 44 on the BTN with 17bb is appropriate, but generally you still have, as you call it, an exit strategy. I think you can still open Q9s from the Hi-Jack and fold versus a jam, leaving yourself with 18bb and not too much difference in your strategy moving forward.

    The charts you found are most likely cEV (chip EV) charts, which means they are appropriate for when you are a long way from the money, rather than for the average stack of 20-30bb. ICM starts to come into play the closer you get to the money bubble and the final table and will suggest alternative ranges for pushing and calling shoves, although they won't be too far from cEV until you reach the last two tables (ish).

    Also, the recommendations we gave in the episode and the hands the chart suggests are for open shoves rather than shoving over raises, just in case that wasn't clear.
  • philby20philby20 Red Chipper Posts: 189 ✭✭
    thanks for the reply i think i might have to chop the 16-20 from the chart. Something that's a little of topic but is related to short stack play in mtts is how do u fell about set mining when 15 to 20 bbs and someone opens utg+1 and you have pocket 55s in the cutoff is this just setting money on fire. This has come up lately in a few tournaments i have played and i decided to set mine and sometimes faced a squeeze other times missed the set ect and then had to go on with 2 less bbs which can be a lot when trying to steal and shove and play poker it could be the difference between villain folding and calling a shove whats your thoughts on this
  • GazelligGazellig RCP Coach Posts: 74 ✭✭
    Yeah I would say set mining when shortstacked is a no-no, unless you're in the big blind and getting a great price. I would definitely fold 55 there in the CO unless UTG+1 is opening wide enough where I can jam over his open. 15-20bb stacks are great for 3-bet jams, and not so great for trying to set mine. You want to maintain your fold equity on these jams by keeping your stack in this area - if you look to play speculative hands you're suddenly down to 13bb and your strategy changes to mainly open shove or fold.

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