Creating a Live Bankroll Challenge

GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
edited January 2017 in Challenge Forum
So one of my biggest problems I have is, I want to play live 1/2 at the Casino, but I don't have thousands of $$$ right now that I can create a "Poker BR" with.... until recently I just went when I had 3-500 of cash from odd jobs and usually it disappeared.

Finally I was able to come out ahead one night in for $150 and out for $603... that started a nice little run of 4 winning sessions giving me a BR of $1050.

Last two sessions I've lost $250ea, so I'm down to $550... I'm putting in some extra $ here and there to pad it up.

My challenge is, I want $3000 for live poker. I've always had great BRM in online poker by having minimum 20BI for each level, when buying in for 100bb. To have that at 1/2 I'll need $4000, but if I buy in short at $150 each time, my BR will be 20bi.

Sounds like a decent plan? I've purchased the Crash Course and am looking forward to crushing my local 1/2 game :)

Comments

  • chip_hoggchip_hogg Red Chipper Posts: 81 ✭✭
    I am interested in building up a bankroll, too. Unfortunately, I've only scraped together $300, and my local casino doesn't have anything smaller than $1/$3... any advice?
  • eugeniusjreugeniusjr Red Chipper Posts: 427 ✭✭✭
    If I had only $300 and had to buy in for $100 at 1-3, I would go on a Friday or Saturday night. Try to sit to the right (not left) of a gambler, someone who like to raise a lot of hands, and limp/back shove AI with TT+, AQ+.

    If you find yourself at a tight table, take a walk and look for a loose one. Someone with beer and a large chip stack is a good sign, especially if they wear a button down shirt. Ask to be moved to that table.
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    Unfortunately at my casino there is rarely more than 1 table running, perhaps Friday/Saturday night there will be two.

    I make a habit of asking for the seat change button if I don't get to sit down where I want right away. That way I get first pick when someone else leaves!
  • AA Red Chipper Posts: 2
    I know that building your first bankroll is hard but a proper bankroll actually serves to protect your edge in a game and because it is hard to build it is also hard to lose.

    Example: You take $300 to the casino and find a table full of bad players. You then lose to a bad beat. This opportunity to earn is sitting right in front of you and you don't have the proper money to play it. Alternatively you take the $300 and play super tight because you are scared to lose your entire bankroll. Both are sub-optimal.

    I'm not going to say that building a bankroll is easy cause it isn't (I worked a part-time job to build my first one) but it is totally worth it to protect your edge in the game.

    Good luck.
  • TravisTravis Red Chipper Posts: 455 ✭✭✭
    Building a bankroll is tough and plain and simple sucks lol. Even more so when you have built one but due to a down swing and other life stuff you have to spend it on other stuff,,,,
    That being said last year I would show up with $300 and do $100 buy ins at !/2. It made me one of the best short stacks players around, I would put half the money from each win session into the bankroll and pocket the other half. By the end of a year I had built up a 4k bankroll and paid off alot of bills. Starting in July I had to start all over both on bank roll and on paying off a bunch of bills.. The same strategy has worked well. I now have paid off almost all the stuff I needed too and have my banroll up to about $2000. SO not I am able to do full buy ins of $300 (though depending on mood and table I will buy in for 100. ..
    The moral is just work at it and also allow your self to enjoy the proceeds not just focus on bankroll. The half of profit to bank roll and half to me had been a nice balance
  • nicnameksnicnameks Red Chipper Posts: 57 ✭✭
    It can't hurt to siphon from your job/other income and commit to not spending winnings until you reach an amount that gives you comfy bankroll cushion.
  • nicnameksnicnameks Red Chipper Posts: 57 ✭✭
    I'm also guessing your plan is to keep $3,000 as your zero balance for the poker bankroll once that threshold is reached?

    I don't know how much you plan on playing, but I'd use that as a baseline and work up from there.

    $10,000 seems to be my comfort zone as a part-time (15-20 hrs/wk) player.

    I don't know how common $3,000 downswings are for a decent (10bb/hr) winner, but I've had more than one $1,500 downswing in the last 1200 hours. The biggest was $2,700.
  • volcanovolcano Red Chipper Posts: 346 ✭✭
    Just dont spend it,if you win it will go up.
  • volcanovolcano Red Chipper Posts: 346 ✭✭
    I get huge downswings and upswings, but I dont play out of a bankroll because of bills.
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    I won't be taking out of my BR for anything, I own my own business and am able to fund the bankroll with side jobs etc... I play once a week, perhaps twice a week if I increase my BR and want to go late Friday Nights too.. so I plan to ideally play twice a week ~5 hours each time, or 10 hours/week.

    I have Playnow.com which is the Canada government run poker site, and I'm playing .05/.10 poker on there, I'd love to start consistently winning online to help build up a roll as well, I can play far more hours there :)
  • volcanovolcano Red Chipper Posts: 346 ✭✭
    edited December 2016
    I play live where dummies throw around cash like its nothing. I lost 650 tonight LOL. its gonna be tougher for you to build a legit bankroll playing smallstakes online in 2017
    oops you are transitioning good luck.
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    Yeah been playing online since 2009 and it's definitely a different game... I'm just sad that I've been playing almost 8 years now and I'm barely out of the penny games :/
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    The bankroll grew a bit this week, sold a couple vehicles and am putting the profits into my BR.

    I am also a chip collector, with my home games using casino paulsons... I decided that I'm going to keep a portion of my BR in chip form and just bring 2-3 buyins of chips with me to the Casino instead of cash... because why not?

    tht2ntt27h9i.jpg

    Hopefully I get some rungood soon, I ran AA into KK AIPF and lost last night, for a $700+ pot at 1/2... was lucky to just leave with breaking even :) My friend came out with $1200 though!! Maniac city
  • Wiki_LeaksWiki_Leaks Red Chipper Posts: 564 ✭✭✭
    I know you titled this post live bankroll challenge, but with a relatively small amount of money to play with and with less than ideal cardroom conditions,why not mostly play online to hone skills and slowly add to your live roll woth extra cash and occasional live sessions?
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    I've been playing online since 2009, and that is where I do hone my skills, and have honed my skills over the years... For 3-5 years we had our night out playing online poker til 11pm ish, only over the past 3 months have we put enough $$$ aside to have our night out *out* at the Casino...

    So essentially, I do both. I have an online roll and play .02/.05 on Stars and .05/.10 on Playnow.com. I have a hard time putting any volume in though, when I go hardcore I might get ~4500 hands per month, but then my carpal tunnel flares up and it affects my work as well.

    Besides... live poker with a dealer is just tits.
  • Doug HullDoug Hull RCP Coach Posts: 1,793 -
    edited December 2016
    This recent article is kind of on this topic:
    http://redchippoker.com/winning-1-2-poker-doug-hull/

    Overwhelmingly, there are a few factors in building a BR:
    • Winning
    • Not spending winnings

    There is something unstated in my article. How did I have the money to buy back all the chips I had won from the Mirage? I had not spent the money.

    This relates to the "Drunkard's walk"

    There is a drunk on the sidewalk where there is a wall on one side and a gutter on the other. With every step he might stumble towards the gutter, or he might stumble towards the wall -there is an equal chance of both for each step.

    If he hits the wall, he just stumbles along the wall until he randomly moves towards the gutter. When he falls into the gutter, the walk is over.

    The drunk will always end up in the gutter.

    When you spend out of your bankroll, you are making your sidewalk narrower. This is another way of thinking about the "risk of ruin" calculations.

    If a mechanic has hard times and starts selling off his tools, he is destroying his ability to earn. There is the old saying "Don't eat your seed corn."


    Co-founder Red Chip Poker,
    Author Poker Plays You Can Use
    Author Poker Workbook for Math Geeks
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    Great advice Doug!

    I think this is how I've never had to reload on Pokerstars since starting in 2009... I've been either a breakeven or winning player, and have never removed $ from the bankroll, even if I only have ~$100 on there... I play within the stakes I can afford.

    With live 1/2 I cannot afford the stakes I play, essentially, because I cannot weather the variance storm very well at all. My goal is to get above that. The only way I can do that is to start out a winning player and in some ways try to reduce variance.

    I'm probably 1/3 the way through the Crash Course and I am confident that I'll be able to skirt the variance storm and ride a wave to a BR :) Hard to have a BR when you're a losing player, right?

  • Doug HullDoug Hull RCP Coach Posts: 1,793 -
    Losing players don't have a bankroll, they have a budget.
    Co-founder Red Chip Poker,
    Author Poker Plays You Can Use
    Author Poker Workbook for Math Geeks
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    Since my goal is to have a BR of 20BI for a current stake, of 1/2 100bb = $4000... our game is max buyin of 150bb or a 20BI roll of $6000...

    So instead of just a generic "Make a BR" challenge, I may morph this into a earn $5000 in poker in 2017, if I play my normal amount of once per week, that will be 260 hours in 2017, or an average needed of $20/h to make $5000.... I'll be able to put a couple extra days per week sometimes so realistically it might be a little under that.

    So that's my goal and challenge to myself for 2017, get to $5000 in poker funds.
  • GoStumpyGoStumpy Red Chipper Posts: 57
    Last night was good and bad... had my name on the list at 6:30, but didn't get seated until 9. That was a long wait.
    Then I had a splitting headache the whole time.. ended up cutting the night short at 10:30pm..

    BUT I managed to end +$211 in 1.5 hours, so overall I say it was a good night!
  • Christopher SChristopher S Red Chipper Posts: 53 ✭✭
    Min buy in wait for a strong hand go all in double up maybe triple up, then cashout go to a different table and do the same thing, unless you feel comfortable with a deeper stack on the table. Sometimes I feel like there's to much pressure if I'm short on buy-in's and I'm sitting with a deep stack. I think it's easier to post a bunch of small wins over time the gains are steady depending on when you decide on your shoving time in relation to your opponents. Remeber your not just shoving you have to understand your opponents. get a few live reads for 2-4 orbits and shove on time not to early or too late. However sitting at a table you can beat is also a reason to stay so make sure to consider your opponents when walking around casino table to table short stack doubling up from everyone. Good luck!

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