What is the optimal strategy for $1/2 with max buy in 100?

Joel DJoel D Red Chipper Posts: 7 ✭✭
I play a $ 1/2 with a 100 max buy in at my local card room. The rake is pretty high being that it's 6 dollars. With only a 50bb stack, I figured that the optimal strategy is to play tight and wait for hands because mostly all the players at that level are loose/passive. Was just wondering what are your thoughts on how to beat this structure and if it can be beaten.

Comments

  • jfarrow13jfarrow13 Red Chipper Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭✭
    Hard to beat for sure. I'd say only play premium, play em hard...play em fast. There was a really good short stacking video out on the internet (mainly for online) but I've followed it and it holds really true.

    It's something along the lines of from EP JJ+ AQ+. Open to $10-12. Hit top pair, profit. Once the pot becomes close to 75% of your stack your shoving. Which generally means...your shoving almost all turns.

    MP expands to 10+ KQ+. Same principle.

    LP you get to add in AJ.

    If someone opens in front of you there is no callling, there is only shoving QQ+AK.

    It's about as boring as it gets...but it's profitable. Obviously it's open for tweaks, if someone opens to $12 you may want to 3-bet QQ to $30 and shove all flops. But that's up to you. This guy advocates not doing that, as adding 20% to your stack is always a good idea, but up to your digression.
  • persuadeopersuadeo Red Chipper, Table Captain Posts: 3,503 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • Wiki_LeaksWiki_Leaks Red Chipper Posts: 546 ✭✭✭
    If you continue to play this game youll either go broke or begin to hate poker, er "poker."
  • CASEY MCASEY M Red Chipper Posts: 100 ✭✭
    I agree with persuadeo and Wiki....
    I used to play a lot of online cash.... Got back into playing live not quite a year ago. I gave up on 1/2 and 2/3 live because of the rake (same as yours) and the cap at 50bb (same as yours)....
    Now Im trying tournaments..... The variance is similar (in my head) due to how loose and wild the average 1/2 player is.

    Wiki is right..... after 6 weeks of playing these cash games I was so stressed at the table it wasnt fun at all, my game slid way downhill.

    The only winners at this level are the ones who move to something else.
  • MonadMonad Red Chipper Posts: 1,004 ✭✭✭✭
    If it's your only option, play it.
  • Zero CoolZero Cool Red Chipper Posts: 233 ✭✭✭
    My regular game use to be at a casino that played 1/3 but with a $200 max buy in and was made worse by most only buying in for 100. After playing this game for a year when I first started studying the game I managed to break even. So my advice is
    1. Find a different game, if thats not possible
    2. Stick to a TAG style, make sure you are playing a stronger range of hands then your opponents
    3. Never limp these games tend to be limp fests but don't fall into the trap.
    4. Get comfortable going for very thin value
    5. Avoid paying them off. Don't call with your flopped set when they clearly hit their flush on the river. Ed Miller has a great video on this in the crash course.
    6. Be prepared to have your mental game tested.

    Good luck.
  • ChibberChibber Red Chipper Posts: 366 ✭✭✭
    I hope this is not the only game in the card room. If so, either lobby for a bigger game or find a different casino.

    Understand that you cannot beat this game long term due to the rake.
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I play in a 1\2\3 game with $200 max and $5 drop if it goes to a flop or $1 if there is no flop. The game is beatable but tips and drop greatly effect win rate. I've been beating the game for a while but I'm not crushing. My tips are below.

    Don't limp too much as you want money in the pot due to drop
    Keep your raise size 4x+
    Play aggressive preflop eithet raising or 3 betting as it benefits you if it ends preflop.
    Table select well. If the game has a lot of regs it's probably not beatable as $150 will go down the drop per hour on average.
  • Adam WheelerAdam Wheeler Red Chipper Posts: 2,628 ✭✭✭✭
    Austin wrote: »
    Table select well.

    Are you guys able to decide on which table you want to play ?
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Austin wrote: »
    Table select well.

    Are you guys able to decide on which table you want to play ?

    If both tables are full take the first seat available. If you have a table in mind i just ask the floor for the first seat at the other table..usually 2-4 tables for 1\3.
  • Adam WheelerAdam Wheeler Red Chipper Posts: 2,628 ✭✭✭✭
    Ok, at my casino, they give you a number and you dont get to choose. Unless we can and i never knew...
  • kageykagey Red Chipper, KINGOFTAGS Posts: 2,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ok, at my casino, they give you a number and you dont get to choose.
    In America - we get to do what we WANT!
  • Adam WheelerAdam Wheeler Red Chipper Posts: 2,628 ✭✭✭✭
    Mmmmmmmmerica !

    The real Mmmmmmmerica or the Trump Mmmmmmerica ?
  • EazzyEazzy Red Chipper Posts: 887 ✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Ive never played these low buy in games. But I believe the best strategy is to double up so you can play deeper with the other players who have doubled up. This means you want to take a more aggro...possibly slightly the worst of it ev strategy (if its not to expensive) to double up. Shoving draws on the flop type thing, even if calling flop and taking the pot away on the turn may be more profitable type thing.

    Once you get the double up, with other big effective stacks (well normal stacks ), then you tend to keep it, now even if calling an all in would be slightly ev+ you might prefer to fold as the gain of playing 100 bb effective out ways some short term ev.

    My guess is these games are played by really bad players. So if you can get doubled up against their stacks is will make up for a lot of the early anoyance of playing shortish.

    One of the best 2-5 games I ever played in (I have not played that much 2-5 yet) was an odd table where over half the table bought in for $200 (the minimum) Two hours later these players had doubled each other up so many times that we had 3 or 4 500 ++ stacks in the hands of lets say not the most talented players.

  • Jónas SJónas S Red Chipper Posts: 202 ✭✭✭
    What can possibly be the reason for allowing a maximum buy in of 50bb?

    Sure, there will be plenty of re-buys, but the casino is capping their potential rake earnings.

    Unless these things turn into shove fests?
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,486 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Jónas S wrote: »
    What can possibly be the reason for allowing a maximum buy in of 50bb?

    Sure, there will be plenty of re-buys, but the casino is capping their potential rake earnings.

    Unless these things turn into shove fests?

    Not really shove fest as a lot of players are pretty passive. Ive asked the floor about it before because my current casino use to be 1\2\2 with
    40-200 buyin. Then they changed it to 1\2\3 with the same buyin structure 40-200. I asked why not raise it to 120-300.

    They said if they allow 300 then 2\5 players will play on the 1\3 table because a lot of 2\5 players buyin 300 at my casino. That was the only reason I got. Guess it allows for casino to have quite a bit of 1\3 and 2\5 tables going same time.
  • moishetreatsmoishetreats Red Chipper Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭✭
    edited September 2017
    Austin wrote: »
    Jónas S wrote: »
    What can possibly be the reason for allowing a maximum buy in of 50bb?

    Sure, there will be plenty of re-buys, but the casino is capping their potential rake earnings.

    Unless these things turn into shove fests?

    Not really shove fest as a lot of players are pretty passive. Ive asked the floor about it before because my current casino use to be 1\2\2 with
    40-200 buyin. Then they changed it to 1\2\3 with the same buyin structure 40-200. I asked why not raise it to 120-300.

    They said if they allow 300 then 2\5 players will play on the 1\3 table because a lot of 2\5 players buyin 300 at my casino. That was the only reason I got. Guess it allows for casino to have quite a bit of 1\3 and 2\5 tables going same time.

    This happened at my local casino, too, when we moved from 1/2 to 1/3. 2/5 players saw the opportunity for 50% more money on the table at 1/3 table -- a table with ostensibly a weaker player pool.

    You'd see some 2/5 players (often some of the better ones) scout the 1/3 tables before sitting down at 2/5. Once in a while, a 2/5 player would play 1/3 for a few weeks to (re-)build a bankroll. And, if the 2/5 list was full, those players would almost always play at 1/3 until their seat opened.

    This is a blessing and a curse. Some of those 2/5 players would just gamble all the time, considering the 1/3 limits to be too low for them to consider it serious cash. Of course, that ended up with them being aggro-aggressive -- something that has high variance but also can be a massively +EV in the short-term. It also had the added affect of scaring away some new 1/3 players.

    The other "curse" is that some of the 2/5 players came to 1/3 to play and win "easier" money: they'd bring their A-game. Good for players who want to grow and learn the game better but terrible for 1/3 grinders and for new players whom you want to come back believing that they have a chance to win.

    At first, I LOVED that 1/2 became a 1/3: more money for me to win. Then, I reveled in the challenge of playing against and eventually out-playing many of the 2/5 players (it went a LOOOOONNNG way to demystifying the 2/5 game for me, where I have shown a profit this year -- and even a greater win-rate than at 1/3). But, it eventually began to affect the 1/3 game adversely, with only the "better" players returning. And, with a higher buy-in, it also starts pricing out some of the players who just want to come and play for the cost of a night out.

    If it were up to me, I'd return the 1/3 game to 1/2. It creates more of a distinct game-play compared to 2/5, thus allowing for greater choice for players given their skill, bankroll, and desire to win vs. learn.

    That being said, 1/3 with a $100-$200 buy-in can still play deep enough. In theory, most of those players are less well-versed in poker concepts than those playing at higher levels, and their understanding of SPR might be relatively low. They'll usually look at bets for their absolute value rather then the SPR, and any big (i.e., all-in) bet will oftentimes be given credit and generate a fold.

    Just keep an eye out for the skilled players who are here looking to grind out some "easy" wins... they'll be easy to spot, though!
  • jfarrow13jfarrow13 Red Chipper Posts: 1,159 ✭✭✭✭
    My local casino started a $1/1 $40 max + min buy-in game to teach new comers. I wonder if the $5 rake applies. You might as well turn over $40 to the casino.

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