3-bet light while playing deep stacks

RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,144 ✭✭✭✭
Hi everybody,

I've found myself in many uncomfortable spot once doubling/tripling up playing 2/5 and facing deep stack good Villain who 3-bet light. Sometimes, I'm totally lost with the range they are using in such situation - I've seen Villain 3-betting 32s, J9o or A8o... Hands I don't expect to be 3-bet and which almost nullifies my hand reading skills :(

I've watched the Pro Video The Course 11 from Ed Miller about deep stacks.
Which other video / podcast / else do you advise about 3-betting light while playing deep stacks or on deep stack game play in general ?

Thanks

Best Answers

Answers

  • bigburge10bigburge10 Red Chipper Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭✭
    I better take another stab at this so that @persuadeo doesn't smack me.

    I really like @moishetreats suggestion to consider the situation at a deeper level. Why is V 3 betting with this range? Are they 3 betting you? Another player?

    Next, what are we going to do about it? So, this player is showing up with 32s--that's great! Lets take advantage of the fact that this player holds so much trash. We'll keep them in the pot when we're strong and try to get them to fold when we have trash.
  • bigburge10bigburge10 Red Chipper Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Actually, I should add--I need to take another stab so I don't smack myself.
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When stacks are deeper, from what I studied its best to have a more polarized range, which is not balanced. It can contain 2\3 bluff to value ratio.

    AA, KK, 43s-65s, Kxs, A2s-A5s, 22-55, AK, then pretty much flat call the rest.

    If he is 3 betting polarized, i would counter by 4 betting polarized as well using blockers.

    2\5
    Hero ($800) opens $20 (4bb) A5s MP
    BTN ($900) 3 bets to $65 (13bb)
    Hero 4 bets to $175 (35bb)
    BTN ?

    Now just assign some polarized ranges and see how well you do RvR. Assuming he will 5 bet shove or fold.
  • RedRed Red Chipper Posts: 2,144 ✭✭✭✭
    Thanks for these interessant answers.

    I will start digging with your info and advises.

    A last thing on the fly :
    Austin wrote: »
    AA, KK, 43s-65s, Kxs, A2s-A5s, 22-55, AK, then pretty much flat call the rest.

    Let's say we are playing deep stack. You see a Villain, who is a good and aggressive player, 3 betting often. He had to show his 3bet hands rarely (pot won before SD), the only times was with AKs, J9o and A8o.
    When he then 3bet you: How do you build his 3bet range ? How do you know which other combos than the obvious premium hands you've to add? Why A2s instead of KJo or 54s?
  • bigburge10bigburge10 Red Chipper Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭✭
    Red wrote: »
    Thanks for these interessant answers.

    I will start digging with your info and advises.

    A last thing on the fly :
    Austin wrote: »
    AA, KK, 43s-65s, Kxs, A2s-A5s, 22-55, AK, then pretty much flat call the rest.

    Let's say we are playing deep stack. You see a Villain, who is a good and aggressive player, 3 betting often. He had to show his 3bet hands rarely (pot won before SD), the only times was with AKs, J9o and A8o.
    When he then 3bet you: How do you build his 3bet range ? How do you know which other combos than the obvious premium hands you've to add? Why A2s instead of KJo or 54s?

    I think it will be very important to take a practical approach to this problem--especially since you won't have time at the table to consider whether you should add in 54s or J9o. Consider the frequencies and the showdown hands--what does that tell you about V's range? What's the best response?


  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ninjah wrote: »
    Austin wrote: »
    When stacks are deeper, from what I studied its best to have a more polarized range, which is not balanced. It can contain 2\3 bluff to value ratio.

    This is not correct. The deeper we are the more we move away from a polarized range and move to a merged range. We want more suited connectors when deeper as we will get called more often and need hands that are playable on a variety of boards and can also make more nutted hands.

    Don't SCs 65s fit into a polarized range? AXs etc?

    Merge range would be somethihg like 99+ AJs+ which will put you into many tough spots in a deep stack game.

    Why not use AA, kk, 54s-87s, 75s-J9s, 66-22? Seems a bit easier to play then AJs+ 99+.
  • AustinAustin Red Chipper Posts: 5,483 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Red wrote: »
    Thanks for these interessant answers.

    I will start digging with your info and advises.

    A last thing on the fly :
    Austin wrote: »
    AA, KK, 43s-65s, Kxs, A2s-A5s, 22-55, AK, then pretty much flat call the rest.

    Let's say we are playing deep stack. You see a Villain, who is a good and aggressive player, 3 betting often. He had to show his 3bet hands rarely (pot won before SD), the only times was with AKs, J9o and A8o.
    When he then 3bet you: How do you build his 3bet range ? How do you know which other combos than the obvious premium hands you've to add? Why A2s instead of KJo or 54s?

    Game of incomplete info. Top and bottom mostly unless he us using a linear range, sounds polarized though. Flat middle range.
  • Danny MDanny M Red Chipper Posts: 353 ✭✭✭
    Sounds like a typical Bovada aggro 3bettor... there are several things you can do... If villain shows J9o well you know that QTo KJo and AQo and likely t9o+ will be in there as well and if you see A8o Is expect to also see A9o ATo etc... if 32s is in there I'd expect 43 54 65+... I'd definitely expect any suited ace, any 2 Broadway, and all pocket pairs to be in this 3b range plus 42s+

    ... what's cool is since this range is super wide villain is going to miss the flop a lot so villain is putting himself in an inflated pot with air often... I have a few ideas of how I would exploit this player... a couple of them would be to open up my 4b value and bluff range (and 6b range if he adjusts) OOP, see a lot of flops IP with hands that flop well i.e. A4s 76s J9s etc, and put on the pressure...

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